[Phpmyadmin-devel] Roadmap? Feature plans for PMA 3.0?
Hi all Does a roadmap for phpMyAdmin exist or has anyone feature plans for phpMyAdmin 3.0? Eventually I ask a bit too early but I would be very interested in such plans. Cheers Marcel Tschopp -- Marcel Tschopp <marcel.tschopp@gmx.net>
Hi Marcel!
Does a roadmap for phpMyAdmin exist or has anyone feature plans for phpMyAdmin 3.0?
I don't know of an "official" MasterPlan. But mine would be (sorted by priority): - Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records - Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al - Have a nice installer - Support transactions and other MySQL 5 features - After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;) I'm curious what the others think about the plans... Regards, Garvin.
Hi all On 15.04.2004 12:23 +0200, Garvin Hicking wrote:
Does a roadmap for phpMyAdmin exist or has anyone feature plans for phpMyAdmin 3.0?
I don't know of an "official" MasterPlan. But mine would be (sorted by priority):
There is IMO none such plan...
- Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records
This is definitely needed for long time and we should finally focus on this.
- Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al
This would be nice, but not much needed...
- Have a nice installer
I'd give this higher priority than db stored configuration.
- Support transactions and other MySQL 5 features
This should have higher pririty as phpMyAdmin 3.0 will come probably in time MySQL 5 will be ready...
- After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;)
Is this really doable? We're working with database on very low level and this would need complete rewrite... - Split out all styles from html (color=, style=, ...) to external css file. -- Regards Michal Čihař http://cihar.com
Michal Čihař a écrit:
Hi all
On 15.04.2004 12:23 +0200, Garvin Hicking wrote:
Does a roadmap for phpMyAdmin exist or has anyone feature plans for phpMyAdmin 3.0?
I don't know of an "official" MasterPlan. But mine would be (sorted by priority):
There is IMO none such plan...
Hi all, This is currently no plan. Here are a few ideas about the roadmap; please do not think I am being negative here... - we currently have a low manpower. Any plan will have to take this into account, even though I agree that the release of 3.0 can attract some other developers - we have a very big features requests list; some day we will have to deal with it - bug fixing takes a lot of time (but I agree that a part of this could be avoided with some structural changes in the code) - we discussed some plans for version 3.0 more that a year ago, I refer you to those discussions - I would concentrate now for the release of 2.6.0.
- Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records
This is definitely needed for long time and we should finally focus on this.
I agree.
- Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al
This would be nice, but not much needed...
I think this is needed a lot. On multi-user installations, lots of parameters are fixed in the config file, but the decision should be in the hands of users. I even find myself in need to change something in the middle of my work session!
- Have a nice installer
I'd give this higher priority than db stored configuration.
I agree for higher priority, partly because it's an easier job to do ;)
- Support transactions and other MySQL 5 features
This should have higher pririty as phpMyAdmin 3.0 will come probably in time MySQL 5 will be ready...
I did not study this enough to have an opinion. I always wondered how to deal with transactions, give the stateless nature of HTTP.
- After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;)
Is this really doable? We're working with database on very low level and this would need complete rewrite...
Not before phpMyAdmin 4.0 please!
- Split out all styles from html (color=, style=, ...) to external css file.
I agree for this one. I got a proposition from a designer about this. Marc
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 10:18 -0400, Marc Delisle wrote:
This is currently no plan. Here are a few ideas about the roadmap; please do not think I am being negative here...
:) we could at least put these ideas / roadmap somewhere on the SF pma account, in the webroot for example.
- we currently have a low manpower. Any plan will have to take this into account, even though I agree that the release of 3.0 can attract some other developers
yes sure, when I see "3.0", I undestand something which would be no sooner than in 3-6 months: it's just good to have a mid-term goal, to see in which direction we are going.
- we discussed some plans for version 3.0 more that a year ago, I refer you to those discussions
do you remember the subject? I just tried to find it in the archive ( http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=2141 ) but without success.
- I would concentrate now for the release of 2.6.0.
+++
- Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al
This would be nice, but not much needed...
I think this is needed a lot. On multi-user installations, lots of parameters are fixed in the config file, but the decision should be in the hands of users. I even find myself in need to change something in the middle of my work session!
which parameters then ? cheers, Olivier
Olivier Mueller a écrit:
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 10:18 -0400, Marc Delisle wrote:
This is currently no plan. Here are a few ideas about the roadmap; please do not think I am being negative here...
:) we could at least put these ideas / roadmap somewhere on the SF pma account, in the webroot for example.
- we currently have a low manpower. Any plan will have to take this into account, even though I agree that the release of 3.0 can attract some other developers
yes sure, when I see "3.0", I undestand something which would be no sooner than in 3-6 months: it's just good to have a mid-term goal, to see in which direction we are going.
- we discussed some plans for version 3.0 more that a year ago, I refer you to those discussions
do you remember the subject? I just tried to find it in the archive ( http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=2141 ) but without success. Here you go:
http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_id=1837749&forum_id=2141
- I would concentrate now for the release of 2.6.0.
+++
- Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al
This would be nice, but not much needed...
I think this is needed a lot. On multi-user installations, lots of parameters are fixed in the config file, but the decision should be in the hands of users. I even find myself in need to change something in the middle of my work session!
which parameters then ?
Here are some ideas: LeftFrameLight ShowBlob ProtectBinary ShowFunctionFields CharEditing PropertiesNumColumns TextareaCols and Rows MaxExactCount NaturalOrder Plus of course all the colors things :)
Hola, On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 12:23 +0200, Garvin Hicking wrote:
- Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records
using php-sessions, or a custom system, based for example on a mysql table?
- Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al
just tell: how often a year do you change your PMA colors and maxrows? :)
- Have a nice installer
+++ (even before 3.0 :)
- Support transactions and other MySQL 5 features
+++
- After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;)
This would be interesting, but would not be phpmyadmin anymore. This could be called 'PearDbAdmin', 'PhpDbAdmin', 'PhpAdodbAdmin', etc... :) just googled a bit: phpdbadmin is already there, at least on SF: http://sourceforge.net/projects/phpdbadmin/, but: "Development Status: 1 - Planning", and seems to be dead. Description is: "PHP-based (multiple-)database administration utility. Bringing multiple database servers and multiple databases together into one simple web-based interface. The power of PHP and the ease of the web. Currently planned to allow easy simultaneous access"
I'm curious what the others think about the plans...
some random ideas for 3.0: - get rid of all the HTML/javascript code from the PHP files -> templates. would require quite a lot of work, so probably it would be good to start from scratch - focus on php5/mysql 4.1+ only (and of course continue to improve PMA 2.x for php4 and mysql4) - newbie / expert mode (newbie -> for example to let my mother update her guestbook entries, expert -> for php devels, etc.) - use "standard" gettext/po files for translations - online interface for translations (put all the strings in a db, to let the translators update their stuff directely) - ... (I once had a list with many other ideas, will look for it :) Regards, Olivier -- _______________________________________________________ Olivier Müller - PGP key ID: 0x0E84D2EA - Switzerland E-Mail: http://omx.ch/mail/ - AIM/iChat: swix3k
Hi Olivier!
using php-sessions, or a custom system, based for example on a mysql table?
I'd say to use the php-sessions. It should work out-of-the box, most of the users also don't get it to installed the pma databases for the other history/relation-features...
just tell: how often a year do you change your PMA colors and maxrows? :)
I have my preference, but on an installation of a webhoster where one installation serves 1000-2000 users, one could want to have a light mode, the other one the graphical mode, one with 2 nested levels, one with 5 levels. One user wants to have a large left frame, the other one has a resolution of 1600x1200 and wants to display the right column tables in 3 columns...I do see a need for adjusting to "per-user" not "per-installation" directives.
- Have a nice installer
+++ (even before 3.0 :)
Yes, that's true. :)
This would be interesting, but would not be phpmyadmin anymore. This could be called 'PearDbAdmin', 'PhpDbAdmin', 'PhpAdodbAdmin', etc... :)
Right, but it would be a neat thing. However I (realistically) do think that we'll never get to that goal. :-)
- get rid of all the HTML/javascript code from the PHP files -> templates. would require quite a lot of work, so probably it would be good to start from scratch
True, very much work indeed, and it would be harder to easily prototype new functions :)
- newbie / expert mode (newbie -> for example to let my mother update her guestbook entries, expert -> for php devels, etc.)
Right, some kind of privilege system would be great (but lot work). So that you can show/hide certain features to certain users.
- use "standard" gettext/po files for translations
What would be the benefits?
- online interface for translations (put all the strings in a db, to let the translators update their stuff directely)
Honestly I think the current way is also very easy to edit multiple strings at once. It would be harder to do on a browser - and just think of the different ISO/UTF8 strings, that could all be messed up by browser input. Regards, Garvin.
Wow, much answers :) Here are my proposals: Olivier wrote:
Hola,
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 12:23 +0200, Garvin Hicking wrote:
- Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records
using php-sessions, or a custom system, based for example on a mysql table? Yes, for session security I think it is better to use a mysql table to store session data. And the user has not to use cookies...
- Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al
just tell: how often a year do you change your PMA colors and maxrows? :)
Could be combined with a template system...
- Have a nice installer
+++ (even before 3.0 :)
- Support transactions and other MySQL 5 features
Eg. views, stored procedures, etc.
+++
- After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;)
This would be interesting, but would not be phpmyadmin anymore. This could be called 'PearDbAdmin', 'PhpDbAdmin', 'PhpAdodbAdmin', etc... :)
just googled a bit: phpdbadmin is already there, at least on SF: http://sourceforge.net/projects/phpdbadmin/, but: "Development Status: 1 - Planning", and seems to be dead. Description is: "PHP-based (multiple-)database administration utility. Bringing multiple database servers and multiple databases together into one simple web-based interface. The power of PHP and the ease of the web. Currently planned to allow easy simultaneous access"
If we would make a code rewrite, it would be easy to make phpMyAdmin (phpDBAdmin?) to work with postgresSQL. Other DBs could also be integrated... :-)
I'm curious what the others think about the plans...
some random ideas for 3.0:
- get rid of all the HTML/javascript code from the PHP files -> templates. would require quite a lot of work, so probably it would be good to start from scratch
+1 for templates. The coding would be much easier!
- focus on php5/mysql 4.1+ only (and of course continue to improve PMA 2.x for php4 and mysql4) My idea is also to make the code cleaner, eg. use an oo-style api (php5), pear coding standarts, pear documentation standarts etc.
- newbie / expert mode (newbie -> for example to let my mother update her guestbook entries, expert -> for php devels, etc.) - use "standard" gettext/po files for translations - online interface for translations (put all the strings in a db, to let the translators update their stuff directely) - ... (I once had a list with many other ideas, will look for it :)
Marc wrote:
Hi all, This is currently no plan. Here are a few ideas about the roadmap; please do not think I am being negative here... I don't think you are negative here :) I agree, this is no plan. But I also think that these few ideas are required because PMA is going to release 2.6.0...
- we currently have a low manpower. Any plan will have to take this into account, even though I agree that the release of 3.0 can attract some other developers
Agreed. Eventually we should write that on the phpmyadmin.net homepage?
- we have a very big features requests list; some day we will have to deal with it
Yes, but at the moment it is really hard to implement those features. As I said above I would really like to make a complete rewrite for 3.0.0. How do you think about that?
- bug fixing takes a lot of time (but I agree that a part of this could be avoided with some structural changes in the code)
Some structural changes or complete rewrite? :-)
- we discussed some plans for version 3.0 more that a year ago, I refer you to those discussions
Thanks, I will look for them!
- I would concentrate now for the release of 2.6.0.
Sure. I only wanted to know if some ideas exist or not... Kind regards Marcel
Hi On 15.04.2004 16:40 +0200, Marcel Tschopp wrote:
Olivier wrote:
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 12:23 +0200, Garvin Hicking wrote:
- Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records
using php-sessions, or a custom system, based for example on a mysql table? Yes, for session security I think it is better to use a mysql table to store session data. And the user has not to use cookies...
Php sessions work also without cookies and you can store them anywhere you want (see session_set_save_handler). This is definitely less work than custom system and also probably more efficient.
- After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;)
This would be interesting, but would not be phpmyadmin anymore. This could be called 'PearDbAdmin', 'PhpDbAdmin', 'PhpAdodbAdmin', etc... :)
just googled a bit: phpdbadmin is already there, at least on SF: http://sourceforge.net/projects/phpdbadmin/, but: "Development Status: 1 - Planning", and seems to be dead. Description is: "PHP-based (multiple-)database administration utility. Bringing multiple database servers and multiple databases together into one simple web-based interface. The power of PHP and the ease of the web. Currently planned to allow easy simultaneous access"
If we would make a code rewrite, it would be easy to make phpMyAdmin (phpDBAdmin?) to work with postgresSQL. Other DBs could also be integrated... :-)
I do not thing it is so easy. Each DB has specific features and to make one code support them all it would become much complicated.
- get rid of all the HTML/javascript code from the PHP files -> templates. would require quite a lot of work, so probably it would be good to start from scratch +1 for templates. The coding would be much easier!
I agree.
- focus on php5/mysql 4.1+ only (and of course continue to improve PMA 2.x for php4 and mysql4) My idea is also to make the code cleaner, eg. use an oo-style api (php5), pear coding standarts, pear documentation standarts etc.
- newbie / expert mode (newbie -> for example to let my mother update her guestbook entries, expert -> for php devels, etc.)
Would be nice and it is much requested, but it's hard to determine what all should be in newbie mode => user should be able to select what he wants to see...
- use "standard" gettext/po files for translations
Probably easier to maintain, but it increases number of php modules needed. How is it with gettext availability on windows?
- online interface for translations (put all the strings in a db, to let the translators update their stuff directely)
Do you know any system that would allow this for po fileS?
- we currently have a low manpower. Any plan will have to take this into account, even though I agree that the release of 3.0 can attract some other developers Agreed. Eventually we should write that on the phpmyadmin.net homepage?
- we have a very big features requests list; some day we will have to deal with it
Yes, but at the moment it is really hard to implement those features. As I said above I would really like to make a complete rewrite for 3.0.0. How do you think about that?
- bug fixing takes a lot of time (but I agree that a part of this could be avoided with some structural changes in the code)
Some structural changes or complete rewrite? :-)
Starting from scratch would help much. It is much work and I'm not sure whether it is necessary right now. But the session stuff is needed and it will trigger many changes, so it's probably good reason for complete rewrite. When talking about this, we should also thing about another version control, that would allow more distributed development (I'm talking about GNU Arch = tla). -- Regards Michal Čihař http://cihar.com
Hi
On 15.04.2004 16:40 +0200, Marcel Tschopp wrote:
Olivier wrote:
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 12:23 +0200, Garvin Hicking wrote:
- Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records
using php-sessions, or a custom system, based for example on a mysql table? Yes, for session security I think it is better to use a mysql table to store session data. And the user has not to use cookies...
Php sessions work also without cookies and you can store them anywhere you want (see session_set_save_handler). This is definitely less work than custom system and also probably more efficient. I agree. You also have to use session_set_save_handler when using a db... I agree also that it is less work, but using a db don't uses very much work...
- After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;)
This would be interesting, but would not be phpmyadmin anymore. This could be called 'PearDbAdmin', 'PhpDbAdmin', 'PhpAdodbAdmin', etc... :)
just googled a bit: phpdbadmin is already there, at least on SF: http://sourceforge.net/projects/phpdbadmin/, but: "Development Status: 1 - Planning", and seems to be dead. Description is: "PHP-based (multiple-)database administration utility. Bringing multiple database servers and multiple databases together into one simple web-based interface. The power of PHP and the ease of the web. Currently planned to allow easy simultaneous access"
If we would make a code rewrite, it would be easy to make phpMyAdmin (phpDBAdmin?) to work with postgresSQL. Other DBs could also be integrated... :-)
I do not thing it is so easy. Each DB has specific features and to make one code support them all it would become much complicated.
But if you have a good oo-interface it is much simpler than now. And pgSQL is pretty similar to mysql. And many people is using pgSQL instead of mysql (i cannot understand the reason :-)
- get rid of all the HTML/javascript code from the PHP files -> templates. would require quite a lot of work, so probably it would be good to start from scratch +1 for templates. The coding would be much easier!
I agree.
- focus on php5/mysql 4.1+ only (and of course continue to improve PMA 2.x for php4 and mysql4) My idea is also to make the code cleaner, eg. use an oo-style api (php5), pear coding standarts, pear documentation standarts etc.
- newbie / expert mode (newbie -> for example to let my mother update her guestbook entries, expert -> for php devels, etc.)
Would be nice and it is much requested, but it's hard to determine what all should be in newbie mode => user should be able to select what he wants to see...
- use "standard" gettext/po files for translations
Probably easier to maintain, but it increases number of php modules needed. How is it with gettext availability on windows?
- online interface for translations (put all the strings in a db, to let the translators update their stuff directely)
Do you know any system that would allow this for po fileS?
- we currently have a low manpower. Any plan will have to take this into account, even though I agree that the release of 3.0 can attract some other developers Agreed. Eventually we should write that on the phpmyadmin.net homepage?
- we have a very big features requests list; some day we will have to deal with it
Yes, but at the moment it is really hard to implement those features. As I said above I would really like to make a complete rewrite for 3.0.0. How do you think about that?
- bug fixing takes a lot of time (but I agree that a part of this could be avoided with some structural changes in the code)
Some structural changes or complete rewrite? :-)
Starting from scratch would help much. It is much work and I'm not sure whether it is necessary right now. But the session stuff is needed and it will trigger many changes, so it's probably good reason for complete rewrite. When talking about this, we should also thing about another version control, that would allow more distributed development (I'm talking about GNU Arch = tla).
Yes, it is very much work. But now we have a few good reasons for that: - using a template system - session stuff - using php5 - cleaner code
-- Regards Michal ÄihaÅ http://cihar.com
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Kind regards Marcel
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 19:12 +0200, Marcel Tschopp wrote:
Php sessions work also without cookies and you can store them anywhere you want (see session_set_save_handler). This is definitely less work than custom system and also probably more efficient. I agree. You also have to use session_set_save_handler when using a db... I agree also that it is less work, but using a db don't uses very much work...
Well, now to install and start using PMA, you just have to get the tar/zip file, unpack it and edit the config.inc.php file. If we use db-based sessions, it would require another step before being able to use phpmyadmin: not really user-friendly, don't you think? (Hint: setup script could do that :) . But I think that PMA should still be able to work without a mandatory DB for config/sessions etc. (just like now: the DB is optional, if it's there it just brings more features). regards, Olivier -- _______________________________________________________ Olivier Müller - PGP key ID: 0x0E84D2EA - Switzerland E-Mail: http://omx.ch/mail/ - AIM/iChat: swix3k
On 15.04.2004 20:15 +0200, Olivier Mueller wrote:
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 19:12 +0200, Marcel Tschopp wrote:
Php sessions work also without cookies and you can store them anywhere you want (see session_set_save_handler). This is definitely less work than custom system and also probably more efficient. I agree. You also have to use session_set_save_handler when using a db... I agree also that it is less work, but using a db don't uses very much work...
Well, now to install and start using PMA, you just have to get the tar/zip file, unpack it and edit the config.inc.php file. If we use db-based sessions, it would require another step before being able to use phpmyadmin: not really user-friendly, don't you think? (Hint: setup script could do that :) .
Yes setup should create all that stuff - pma user, database and all needed tables.
But I think that PMA should still be able to work without a mandatory DB for config/sessions etc. (just like now: the DB is optional, if it's there it just brings more features).
Sessions handling could be let on php, what is sometimes considered to be less secure (you can quite easily steal session from another php script running on same server). But it should work. -- Regards Michal Čihař http://cihar.com
Hi there, Garvin Hicking wrote:
Does a roadmap for phpMyAdmin exist or has anyone feature plans for phpMyAdmin 3.0?
I don't know of an "official" MasterPlan. But mine would be (sorted by priority):
- Get sessions to work, to get around POST/GETing the SQL query or the resultset data from page to page. This is the reason for many timeout/browser problems when editing records
agreed
- Have DB-stored configuration with user-management, where a PMA user can tweak his own settings regarding colors, maxrows, sql query window et al
- Have a nice installer
You want to implement a DB-stored config before installer...? I'd rather do it the other way round.
- Support transactions and other MySQL 5 features
We need an interface to the new stored procedures feature!
- After that is all done, make PMA work on all OpenSource RDBMS ;)
And finally: world domination! Regards, -- Alexander M. Turek <rabus@users.sourceforge.net> _ __ __ _ _ _ _ __ | |__ _ __ | \/ |_ _ / \ __| |_ __ ___ (_)_ __ | '_ \| '_ \| '_ \| |\/| | | | | / _ \ / _` | '_ ` _ \| | '_ \ | |_) | | | | |_) | | | | |_| |/ ___ \ (_| | | | | | | | | | | | .__/|_| |_| .__/|_| |_|\__, /_/ \_\__,_|_| |_| |_|_|_| |_| |_| |_| |___/ <http://www.phpmyadmin.net>
participants (6)
-
Alexander M. Turek -
Garvin Hicking -
Marc Delisle -
Marcel Tschopp -
Michal Čihař -
Olivier Mueller